Distributed Temperature Sensing pt 2

In part 2 of the Distributed Temperature Sensing Series, Gavin comes back to Debunk more misconceptions about DTSX.  Why should one select this product for a project? How are these units maintained?  and a particular application for leak detection is also debunked by Gavin and Sean. 

Transcript

 [00:00:10.430] - Sean 
Welcome back to Yokogawa Debunks conversations with industry experts to demystify misconceptions we hear in process instrumentation and industrial automation. I'm your host, Sean Cahill, and thank you very much for joining us today. So today we're very pleased to welcome back Gavin French, who's product manager for distributed temperature sensing at Yokogawa Australia and New Zealand. Now previously, Gavin has given us great insights into the DTSX, and today I think we're going to discuss a little bit further on some of the applications. So welcome once again Gavin. 

 [00:00:43.610] - Gavin 
Thank you very much again for having me, Sean. Much appreciated. 

 [00:00:48.530] - Sean 
Now Gavin, we went into the depths before of the technology, and now it stimulated a lot of interest in me as to the types of applications, and what I want to start by doing is putting my end-user hat on. So I'm an end user who is contemplating using DTSX for the next project. And there's a few applications here that I'm thinking it could possibly be suitable for, apart from some of the experience and pedigree that you alluded to previously, I mean, why should I buy DTSX from you and from Yokogawa rather than units available elsewhere in the market? 

 [00:01:22.850] - Gavin 
Yeah, Very good question Sean. It's quite simple. And I think I've mentioned it in previous podcasts is when you're looking when the customers have a need for long distribution sensing what we are trying to do as well as co-innovate with the clients, we are also there to mitigate risk because of the size of the investment that they need to make. So, from that end, it's not just a turnkey for the project, It's a life-cycle agreement. We are there with the customer the entire time that they have the machine installed and protecting their assets. 

 [00:01:59.450] - Gavin 
So, from yourself being the owner of a plant, what we find is most important to the customer is mitigation of risk and also to provide value and ongoing support. That's what we offer the market as Yokogawa Australia. 

 [00:02:13.010] - Sean 
Look, and those are critical aspects. Many people who have highly specialized equipment do actually suffer from that lack of support. So, you certainly get a feeling here that That's not the case with DTSX. Now, when you talk about support for these devices, you mentioned in previous podcasts about Yokogawa and a channel partner in fire detection. In what other ways do we maintain the products here locally? 

 [00:02:40.730] - Gavin 
Yeah, for sure. So, in Yokogawa Australia, we have approximately 250 staff and within that 250 staff, we have our deliverables department. And what that is, as part of that team is a collection of highly skilled engineers, and these highly skilled engineers are there as a resource for our customers. They are there for in the initial setup of the DTSX units. They're there for the calibration. They're there to make sure that the information that's taken from the machine is inputted into there, whether the customer has a historian or other forms of data collection and manipulation of that data for the purpose of running their plant effectively. 

 [00:03:25.790] - Gavin 
Alternatively, it's there to also offer the protection for the customer and give insights into any potential hazards before they happen. 

 [00:03:36.230] - Sean 
So I guess, is there a support contract available once the investment in the installation of a DTSX has occurred? 

 [00:03:44.330] - Gavin 
Yeah, absolutely. Sean. So, what we have available. And once again, it's not just Australia and New Zealand and around the world is a life-cycle agreement where we will maintain the machine on the customer's behalf. We will ensure the DTSX is running in peak performance and to give the customer that the peace of mind to know that whilst they cannot see the machine, it's sitting there in the background doing its work tirelessly day in, day out, every year, every minute of every day. And we can give them the satisfaction of knowing that it's running in peak performance by having our qualified engineers on site when required to conduct those required ongoing maintenance or testing. 

 [00:04:33.950] - Sean 
Sort of builds on that reliability, support, and availability that Yokogawa are famous for. Now moving on to some applications now, is it true or false that you could actually use the DTSX to detect leaks in pipelines and over long distances, potentially? What do you think about that? 

 [00:04:51.710] - Gavin 
Yeah, absolutely. Yes, absolutely. You can. And it's suitable in both. We've touched on previous podcasts about single-mode or multi-mode utilization, so both types of fibre networks can be utilized in leak detection and absolutely over long distances. 30 km is not an unusual length for us to be monitoring a pipeline and even down to the smallest leaks by having that being able to see that change in temperature caused by even a pinhole leak is something that we can detect and report on. So absolutely. 

 [00:05:27.530] - Sean 
Look, I mean, you mentioned pinhole leaks. Is that something that can be picked up by DTSX fairly accurately and quickly? 

 [00:05:34.910] - Gavin 
Yes, absolutely. And we have been working tirelessly with one of our largest customers to come up with a design that allows for exactly that to see within the weakest point of a pipeline, which is traditionally as a Weld and we are monitoring actually, in essence, we are monitoring the Welds to be able to direct any leak that they have onto the sensing cable. For that reason, our customers now feel that Yokogawa have provided a world-class solution and we're helping them to maintain their pipeline now and into the next 30, 40 years. 

 [00:06:12.470] - Sean 
I mean, one of the things with pipeline leak detection is to prevent it getting really bad, It needs to be detected quickly, I mean, can it be detected fairly quickly using DTSX? 

 [00:06:23.450] - Gavin 
Well, if you look at the traditional ways of that, if it's not a differential pressure and that doesn't always work on undulating pipelines, but if differential pressure is not used, then the manual inspection method is very much an unreliable and often can often be missed or by the time it is found, the pinhole leak has become a rupture. So, the idea with the DTSX is that we are able to take away the risk associated with once a day or once an hour or once a week inspection of pipelines. 

 [00:07:03.290] - Gavin 
We will automate the inspection, I guess, is what we're looking at there, via having sensing cables there attached just below the pipeline. If it's a liquid or just above the pipeline, if it's a gas and we can pick up that leak within a few seconds, no problems at all, Sean. 

 [00:07:18.650] - Sean 
So, it could potentially be a better alternative to mass flows in outlets and pipelines. 

 [00:07:25.370] - Gavin 
Yeah, absolutely. Like I mentioned earlier, and particularly with some of our customers have very much undulating pipelines, and they do actually have issues with inaccuracy with that measurement and the reliability that they get. The knowledge that they get the insight that they get from having a DTSX goes way beyond anything they have ever had before. 

 [00:07:49.910] - Sean 
That's great. There's another misconception that we picked out after our last session, which relates to weather in Australia and the fact that a lot of these pipelines actually run in the middle of deserts where temperature can be nearing 50 degrees in the hottest months. And we're talking about fibre optic here, which is quite resistant to ambient temperature. But is there any true to the myth that fibre longevity and measurement might be hindered by such extreme weather? 

 [00:08:19.550] - Gavin 
Good question. If you're talking in terms of the cable, definitely not. We're lucky that we have partnered ourselves with a high-quality cable company and companies that we insist that the types of fibre that we use, which is called OM3 or optical multi-mode 3 or better, means that the quality of the signals that we receive and that we send, will be the best, and we know that the accuracy and the repeatability from that will be perfect. So, we do ensure that the cable meets the application specs perfectly or actually in all times exceeds the expectation of the installation. 

 [00:08:59.330] - Gavin 
So, we look at the high temperatures, the low temperatures, the exposure, the chemicals, the environment as well, if there's mechanical protection required. So, we do take that into account. And further to that is when you talk about the extreme temperatures and how that affects the machine. We do have the ability within the DTSX to take into account things like the changes in the weather, the seasons. All these exposures all have effect on the temperature being measured. But within the DTSX is the ability to see beyond the environmental conditions and to look for that what we call a spot change or an exception change. And that exception change is what we identify as a potential leak or rupture. 

 [00:09:50.450] - Sean 
That certainly gives people peace of mind that in harsh environments, that they don't have to be concerned about the technology employed because of the risks by extreme weather. Now, there's another misunderstanding here that in the events of a leak, the fibre will detect it. But if the fluid being monitored has acids or other harsh chemicals in it, could that damage the cable? And as such, would it be necessarily to replace it, or could it be repaired? 

 [00:10:18.590] - Gavin 
Yeah, very good question. And often these are conversations earlier on in the piece when we are discussing the environmental circumstances and possible scenarios with our clients. So, in terms of exposure is concerned, there's a lot of variation, I suppose, in terms of chemical exposure and environmental conditions, even things like animals you can use, like a polyurethane sheath to protect from animal bites. You can use a PVC sheath to protect from sulfuric acids. So as part of the Coinnovation with our clients, is also the correct application of the sheath of the cable. 

 [00:11:01.430] - Gavin 
And even like I mentioned earlier, down to the quality of the fibre, and even down beyond that, as far as the gel, the hydroscopic gel that we use around the fibre optic cable around the fibre bundles themselves to actually protect the fibre from exposure to hydrogen atoms or just even water in general, that can degradate a fibre optic cable. We are there to let our customers know that the pre-engineering and application side of any cable that we use has been done and taken into account. 

 [00:11:39.470] - Gavin 
and just on the side when it comes to the repair of the cable Sean, and that's an important thing to note as well. There's two things that we do. One is that we provide as part of any installation. We have a calibration loop that lives along any pipeline or any installation. That allows for us. If there is a major catastrophe where we have to replace long lengths of cable that that's done seamlessly and in the customer's eyes, the potential downtime is mitigated to virtually nil. And if it's just a small break caused by any environmental or an accident or something that's happened, the cables can be repaired locally. 

 [00:12:17.690] - Gavin 
The fibres are a standard fibre size we use basically is 51. 25 Micron fiber optic cable, which is just fusion spliced. And in any sort of major town or city in Australia, there are companies there communication companies that have fusion splices in stock, ready to go to site and effect a repair. And more often than not, our clients have access within 2 hours to get these cables repaired. And as well as that, one thing I forgot to mention is that when we supply a fibre cable for our customers, we always have 50% in what we call redundant fibres. 

 [00:12:58.790] - Gavin 
So even if one breaks or two break, more often than not, we supply four fibre bundle. So, we have two spare fibres sitting there ready to power up the installation, and that can effectively be done in seconds. 

 [00:13:12.650] - Sean 
Certainly, reinforces that resilience aspect of the solution. And, as many of these applications may be put in fairly remote areas, knowing that there are quick and easy support mechanisms to be able to recover from any difficult situation is even more beneficial. Now, I just want to focus on the cables for a little bit longer. And you indicated earlier that the fibre optic cables are actually Yokogawa branded, and it's your recommendation to use such a cable. But as an end-customer, could I use a non-Yokogawa cable? 

 [00:13:47.990] - Gavin 
Absolutely. Part of the reason that we do supply our own Yokogawa sensing cable is to maintain peak performance. And whilst its customers are quite okay to use their own fibre network, if we can concentrate just for a minute on Yokogawa cable, and then what we're looking at there is a known grade of fibre. So, I mentioned earlier the OM3 spec fibre, which is quite a high level, and we do that to ensure peak performance for our customers. In saying that if they have an existing network, whether it's single mode or multi-mode, really doesn't matter, we can turn any cable into a sensing cable by simply attaching a connector to go into the DTSX. 

 [00:14:37.790] - Gavin 
and away we go. And more often than not, that's what the customers are looking for. We have an existing network. Can we use it? Absolutely. You can. No problems at all. 

 [00:14:49.310] - Sean 
Great news. Look, I'm going to throw one at you here. So, since we spoke last time, we had a question which came in as to whether it would be suitable for measuring temperature on high voltage cables. 

 [00:15:02.030] - Gavin 
Yes, absolutely. And it's a market that we've been servicing for a long time. There are a lot of customers that have high voltage cables, whether it's Port handling cranes or even underground mains networks. A lot of the power distribution companies in Australia now use integrated fibre in their HV cables and primarily in 33 KV and above, which are typically balanced loads. So that when we're looking at the temperature in those cables, it's just once again, it's just a simple matter of taking one of the spare fibres in the bundle that they have, and we only need one fibre. 

 [00:15:43.970] - Gavin 
We terminate that with a connector, and it gets plugged straight into the DTSX. And then what that gives any customer that has integrated fibre in their Hv cables, they know straight away exactly what's happening As far as the load is concerned. If it's underground mains, they can do load shedding, they can move power from one transformer to another. You can move it from industrial estate to residential and different times of the day, such as in the morning and the afternoon. What it does is it gives an incredible amount of insight into the performance of their power networks. And it's a fantastic thing and one that a lot of our customers see fantastic value in. 

 [00:16:27.650] - Sean 
Look, certainly just picking up on the fact that you can use spare fibre, that's going to save quite a chunk of money on installation costs when you put DTSX in there. That was impressive to hear. Now, just want to flick back to early conversation where we're talking about measurement ranges and how the cable is rated from somewhere down to -40 degrees to plus 85 degrees. Does that mean that users can't select DTSX for an application like, let's say, a hot reactor in a plant that goes beyond that plus 85 degree range. If they did, What would happen to the actual sensing unit? 

 [00:17:07.850] - Gavin 
So basically, the machine itself we mentioned in previous podcast is that it is a collector of information, so it will see the temperature that the cable as it sends out the pulse. What it sees is that actual temperature. So basically, what we need to do is we need to address the type of cable, and we need to make sure that the type of cable matches the installation. So, we touched on the chemical side before what we're looking at here is a higher temperature cable with it's going to need increased mechanical protection plus some protective coatings over the fibre to ensure that it is able to go beyond the standard 85 deg C 

 [00:17:55.970] - Gavin 
In terms of a reactor. Absolutely. We have a lot of experience in this area where we can actually map reactors and look for cold and hot spots and give the customers insight into the performance of those reactors. And once again, the only thing that will change, Sean, is the type of cable used. So, if it goes two or 300 degrees C, it's just a different cable basically. 

 [00:18:17.630] - Sean 
The range of requests keep coming in from last time as well. I've had a request about sewer monitoring, whether that's something that's possible with DTSX? 

 [00:18:29.750] - Gavin 
Yes. Actually, it's funny, as you say, that the first DTSX sold in Australia and New Zealand, it was actually in New Zealand where they're using the fibre cable within the wastewater lines to look for ingress of stormwater and also groundwater. So, with that, we can monitor and basically as wastewater is at a specific temperature. And yeah, we're able to give our customers a very good insight into exact location of any ingress and the time of day that it happens. 

 [00:19:06.290] - Gavin 
Yeah. Absolutely. It's been done before and councils and waterboards around Australia are looking at that technology as well. 

 [00:19:14.450] - Sean 
It certainly seems like it's an unending range of applications for DTSX. Now, given we're running out of time again here. It's been a very insightful conversation again and is really sort of built upon the previous discussion. Just before we close out. I just wonder if there's anything else that you might want to share with our audience today. 

 [00:19:35.150] - Gavin 
I think the only one that I really would like to drive home is that in dealing with Yokogawa, we're there to support our customers and have for over 32 years here in Australia. And I think it's 105 years now since the inception of Yokogawa. So, our commitment is that we have demonstration units that we can put in situ for our customers to allow our customers to experience the machine, see what it can do before they make the purchase, decide to purchase. And it is a very good way of showing the value and also giving the customers a bit more of an insight into the capabilities of Yokogawa. That's our commitment to the industry. 

 [00:20:19.550] - Sean 
And These demo equipment is available to test on any of these applications. I guess just a case of contacting you. 

 [00:20:25.250] - Gavin 
Yeah, absolutely. Any of the States, there's any of our offices around Australia and New Zealand. And don't worry if it's single mode or multi-mode installations, we have both machines that are available for the customers to use, and we will also quite happy to leave the machine with them for a month or two to help them make their decision an easy one. 

 [00:20:47.870] - Sean 
Great news. Couldn't ask for more. Well, Gavin, thank you very much once again for your time delving in deep to the DTSX myths. 

 [00:20:55.310] - Gavin 
Thank you very much, Sean. I really appreciate the opportunity. Thank you very much. 

[00:20:59.210] - Sean 
And thank you all for listening. And if you'd like any further information on DTSX, please drop us a line on debunks@yokogawa.com until next time. Farewell.